The Vice Presidential Debate

All times listed below are EST.

10:45 PM - MG - Overall: I thought Biden seemed knowledgable and intelligent and passionate and a bit mouthy, which, it just so happens, is pretty much what Joe Biden is. I thought Palin seemed like someone who knew basic Republican talking points--not just because she's crammed, but because she's part of a generation of a Republican politicians trained in basic Republican talking points--but not much more than that. And she did a perfectly good job of emphasizing some of the basic differences between the two tickets on Iraq. What I don't know is whether Average Americans will think she sounded like an Average American, and whether they would consider that a good thing. She did say "doggone it," so I guess that makes her folksy. We do seem to want our pilots to sound folksy--otherwise why would they all use that same Chuck Yeager accent?--so maybe we want our Vice Presidents to sound folksy too. But most of all, I hope that 7-year-old girl doesn't drop the baby.

10:41 PM - JP - My wrapup: Biden didn't call Palin an offensive name; Palin didn't do Tina Fey doing Tina Palin. By the negative frame in which this debate was set, both candidates succeeded at not doing what they needed not to do. Or something like that. 

10:39 PM - KT - Wrapup post:

Palin didn¹t make any big mistakes, but she also didn¹t reassure that she could handle the presidency. She was earnest and well-prepared.

Biden was as good - and as human - as he has ever been. If we have to pick a winner, it's Biden.

At least, that¹s what the CEOs seem to think. 

10:34 PM - MG - My wife makes an excellent point: Isn't it past that baby's bedtime? Ours was kind enough to fall asleep around 8:58 p.m.

10:33 PM - KT - @JP: They are loving Joe Biden. They are also loving the guy who is pouring the wine.

10:31 PM - JP - @KT: How did the CEOs like Biden's saying he's not running to help out the CEOs?

10:30 PM - MG - This closing statement sounds like she's giving a speech to the College Republicans. We're going to fight for America! We're proud of America! Our freedoms are at risk! It's really amateur hour. And since I think that, the pundits will undoubtedly declare that she's hit a home run, and McCain will skyrocket in the polls.

10:29 PM - JP "I like being able to answer these tough questions without the filter of the mainstream media." Or Katie Couric asking me for those stupid specific examples!

10:27 PM - JP - "Having just spent 90 minutes attacking your opponent's running mate, how would you change the tone in Washington?"

10:27 PM - KT - @JP: I was thinking the same thing. Wonder if my mom and my aunt, sitting somewhere near the front of the audience, got the reference. (And where are those crowd shots?)

10:25 PM - MG - Just curious: What does Joe Biden think was Jesse Helms's benign motivation for being a vile racist?

10:24 PM - KT - @KT: Also—unless I misheard again—one that referenced the tragedy with his wife and subsequently raising his son. But I wasn't clear if he mentioned it in a way that you would know that, unless you already knew that story. Maybe I missed something while typing. 

10:24 PM - MG - Pro-America! Pro-democracy! Pro-freedom! Pro-reform? Is this really what Joe Sixpack wants to hear? I have to doubt it. I don't think Joe Sixpack is that vapid.

10:24 PM - JP - Biden clearly spent a long time listening in on that conversation at that kitchen table. 

10:24 PM - KT - @JP: It was his best, most authentic answer.

10:23 PM - JP - Sarah Palin has a bracelet too. And it says, "Greed and corruption on Wall Street."

10:21 PM - JP - Maybe I misheard, but did Biden just claim he was a victim of anti-male sexism here?

10:19 PM - JP - The CNN chyron says Gwen Ifill's question was "What is your real Achilles heel as a candidate?" Which is good, because I couldn't figure out what she was asking when she asked it. Also, isn't that basically up there with, "Where do you see yourself in five years?"

10:18 PM - JP - "Say it ain't so, Joe, there you go again, you're pointing fingers back..." I think we just witnessed the mythical Triple Zinger!

10:18 PM - KT - HUGE applause from the women CEOs on Biden's line about Cheney being the most dangerous VP in history. You'd think they would like a unitary executive.

10:14 PM - MG - Another pet peeve: Why shouldn't we look back at the past? I'd say the last eight years are pretty relevant right now. What's the line about how the past isn't even past?

10:13 PM - KT - Palin on Biden's wife being a teacher: “Her reward is in Heaven.” Christie Hefner: “Yeah, we don't want to raise their salaries on Earth.”

10:12 PM - MG - I keep thinking of that fantasy debate scene from The West Wing where the empty-suit candidate keeps mouthing talking points and Jeb Bartlett jumps in and says: And then what? Again, I know I'm a horrible sexist and elitist and knowledgist for saying this, but I have no idea how Sarah Palin would answer that question after she finishes her talking points. She seems like she's crammed pretty well. And she's given some reasonable answers, like she just did with that line about how she differs with McCain about ANWR. But: And then what?

10:11 PM - JP - "Say it ain't so, Joe, there you go again, you're pointing fingers back..." I think we just witnessed the mythical Triple Zinger!

10:09 PM - JP - Palin segues from uncomfortable talk of McCain's hypothetical death to "I intend to keep pushing him on ANWR." But don't push him too hard! You might kill him!

10:09 PM - KT - Waaaayyy too much talk about John McCain dying.

10:07 PM - JP - I recall reading that Sarah Palin was planning on attacking Biden heavily. Doesn't seem like it to me. And Biden emphatically doesn't want to attack Palin. So we have two people arguing vociferously about two people who are not in the room. 

10:07 PM - KT - John McCain “knows how to win a war.” Has anyone told her he was in Vietnam?

10:06 PM - JP - I guess this is what happens when you have three Senators on the national tickets, but "I held hearings" is not a compelling stump line. 

10:03 PM - JP - Rwanda gets Biden engaged in a way few things have in this debate. I know the general plan was probably to get him to dial it down to 3 or 4, but he works better up at 8 or 9. 

10:03 PM - MG - Once again, look at those trend lines: the undecided voters loved what Biden said about stopping genocide in Darfur. 

Seriously, do you think they're really undecided, or did they just want to be on TV? 

10:02 PM - MG - "I admit I was the first one to recommend it." And thus prevented genocide. Manfully admitted, Joe! (I do like calling you Joe.)

10:01 PM - JP - @MG & KT: Yeah, I'm sure the Afghanistan line must be effective in some circles. But politically, don't you want your guy to say that we've spent more on 3 weeks in Iraq than we've spent on [x number of health-care policies or other thing the voter likes]?

9:59 PM - MG - Wow. Is that true that we spend more in 3 weeks in Iraq than we've spent in 6 years in Afghanistan? I've never finished a sixpack in my life and I didn't know that.

9:59 PM - KT - @MG: Depends which finger.

9:56 PM - KT - @JP: Are we back to comparing bracelets?

9:55 PM - MG - Will someone please tell me what is wrong with finger-pointing? I'm a huge believer in finger-pointing. I've written about this in the past:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/02/17/AR2006021702497.html 

9:55 PM - JP - You know, it occurs to me that a lot of people who know more than I do will parse the foreign-policy answers. But I have a feeling, after the last week, the salient concern in the McCain camp is that Palin be seen on stage by millions of people using the names of a lot of foreign countries and leaders, and pronouncing them correctly. 

9:53 PM - JP - Two American politicians who agree they love Israel on the same stage?! What are the odds?

9:53 PM - JP - @KT: What, they didn't dispatch Carly Fiorina to the powerful-women conference to even out the cheering sections?

9:52 PM - KT - Lots of applause here on Biden's government of Spain line. 

9:51 PM - MG - The Spain flap is just a wonderful example of the McCain campaign in action. McCain clearly misheard a question, or thought the interviewer was talking about some Latin American leftist, or whatever. But when you're obsessed with news cycles, you can't admit a mistake. So the kooks around McCain say hell yeah, he meant exactly what he said. And so a non-wingnut politician gets committed to wingut policies.

9:51 PM - JP - Love all the talk about Spain in this year's debates. Takes me back to 1898. 

9:49 PM - MG - I can't spea
k for Joe Sixpack, but I'd be OK if I never heard the words "passion" and "Kissinger" in the same sentence ever again.

9:49 PM - JP - Palin somehow makes "dictators—who hate America!" sound like such a friendly line. 

9:46 PM - KT - Sarah Palin is way better at pronouncing Ahmadinejad than McCain is. 

9:46 PM - JP - Check "stinking corpse" off to-do list. 

9:46 PM - MG - I know I shouldn't be watching those ridiculous CNN lines, but did you see the women get happy when Biden started talking about the central front of the war being outside Iraq?

9:43 PM - MG - Warning: More substance. I hate it when politicians say they're going to do whatever the generals say. Even Bush says this, and to his credit, things have improved in Iraq since he stopped doing whatever his generals were saying and found a new set of generals who would change course.  You wouldn't say you'd do whatever the assistant labor secretary says.  Why would you commit to following any advisor's advice?

9:40 PM - KT - Did Sarah Palin just go beyond McCain's position on civil rights for gays? I think so.

9:37 PM - JP - Wait, so equal benefits for same-sex couples sometimes undermines the definition of marriage... except in Alaska? Does cold make people more heterosexual?

9:34 PM - JP - Men in focus-dial group like line "Drill, baby, drill!" much better than women. I leave you to draw your own conclusions. 

9:33 PM - JP - Further to that earlier point about climate change: Palin can give precisely the same answer she gave Couric here, but it sounds much more confident and less nervous in this venue. 

9:32 PM - JP - But will "I don't want to argue about the details" work as an answer about the dinosaurs?

9:31 PM - MG - Warning: Substance alert. I'm sorry, I know we're supposed to be respectful, and I know she's proud to be Joe Sixpack, but that is a RIDICULOUS answer about global warming.  It obviously matters what causes global warming, because if it's caused by the Boston terriers that are currently curled up on my floor, then we ought to do something about them, and if it's caused by nature, then there isn't a damn thing we can do about it, but if it's caused by carbon emissions, then that's on us, and we better do something about carbon emissions.

9:31 PM - JP - I think Sarah Palin is giving—at least at the beginning—the verbatim same answer on global warming she gave Katie Couric.

9:30 PM - JP - Oooh, East Coast politicians! Note to Palin: Pennsylvania and Virginia are East Coast states.

9:29 PM - MG - KT: I'd say reasonable people can disagree about the bangs.  But that jacket? It looks like curtains dipped in nuclear waste.

9:28 PM - KT - Wish they would show more crowd shots. My mom and my Aunt Eileen are sitting somewhere near the front.

9:28 PM - JP - @KT: And I like Joe's sexy crow's feet.

9:27 PM - JP - Fannie and Freddie were rearing their heads! Just like Putin! I bet they saw it first in Alaska.

9:27 PM - KT - @MG: I also like Sarah Palin's bangs.

9:26 PM - JP - Free money for everybody, just like in Alaska! Now you're talking!

9:26 PM - KT - @MG: And by the way, I LIKE Gwen's jacket.

9:25 PM - MG - That's clever of Biden to align himself and Obama with Palin's windfall profit tax.  I also enjoyed the way Palin said she would have supported the bailout with the enthusiasm of a kid being sent to the principal's office.

9:23 PM - JP - On CNN, focus-dial groups don't respond well at all to attack lines. Which makes me doubt dial groups that much more. What will we have for dial groups in 2012? Will they be plugged in directly through USB ports in their heads?

9:22 PM - KT - Shalala on Biden's health care answer: “Nailed it.” Women in this room erupted in cheers. Who knew there were so many Democratic CEOs?

9:20 PM - JP - Check "Bridge to Nowhere" joke off to-do list. 

9:20 PM - MG - OK, Joe--can I call you Joe?--that may be fairness. But it is, in fact, redistribution, no matter what you call it in Scranton.

9:18 PM - MG - She's got to stop laughing at her own zingers. And she's got to take those bangs to the Tresseme hair salon.

9:17 PM - KT - Biden: I posted too soon. Six mentions of the middle class in one answer. 

9:17 PM - JP - And the race to say "middle class" more than the other guy is on!

9:16 PM - JP - Biden seems to have been effectively coached to keep his responses as uninteresting as possible. 

9:16 PM - KT - Biden: Three mentions of the middle class in one answer. So far.

9:15 PM - KT - Palin's first shot at Gwen: I may not answer the questions as you or the moderator want to hear...

Gwen: Okay, our time is up here...

Don't mess with the moderator

9:14 PM - MG - "I may not respond to the questions the way you want as a moderator," which in this case means, "I may not respond to the questions at all." I guess she credits chutzpah credit. (Having just read the Yiddish Policeman's Union, I know that chutzpah is an Alaskan phrase.)

9:14 PM - JP - Sarah Palin boldly vows to not answer the moderator's questions, if that's what it takes to talk straight to the American people!

9:13 PM - MG - How many times are you allowed to repeat the $42,000 lie before you become a liar?

9:13 PM - KT - Loud guffaws at “darn right.” Donna Shalala notes that neither one is paying any attention to the questions.

9:13 PM - JP - Did anyone add "Darn right!" to the drinking game rules?

9:10 PM - MG - Good for Sarah Palin for talking about people needing to live within their means.  But it's the kind of things politicians are supposed to bemoan but not actually address, which is why she immediately pivoted into the horrible exploitation of the American people.

9:09 PM - MG - We need someone new who hasn't been in Washington for a long time: Weird McCain campaign slogan.

9:08 PM - KT - Ack! Sarah Palin just winked at me!

9:08 PM - KT - Joe Biden has almost as many friends on the Republican side of the aisle as the Democratic side of the aisle. Does that mean he has a lot of friends or a few?

9:08 PM - JP - CNN focus dial group likes mention of soccer, does not like mention of campaign suspension.

9:06 PM - KT - So which will we hear more? Joe Biden mentioning the middle class or Sarah Palin mentioning the “privilege” of getting elected?

9:05 PM - JP - CNN is using their little judges-scorecards on their HD feed again. Three judges gave Palin a point before anyone spoke. She literally got credit for showing up.

9:04 PM - MG - As a Project Runway obsessive I must ask: What the hell is Gwen Ifill wearing?  Is the contrast off on my TV?

9:03 PM - MG - Sarah Palin just walked across the stage without falling on her face, and correctly identified Joe Biden's first name as "Joe." She is clearly exceeding expectations, and I hope all those out-of-touch Beltway pundits who doubted her are writing their apologies as we speak.

9:02 PM - JP - Gwen Ifill: all controversy over the Obama book aside--I sort of wanted her to show up wearing a HOPE pin just to screw with people—how lucky is she? For the second election in a row, she gets named for the second-banana debate, and people actually end up caring about it.

8:59 PM - JP - CNN just introduced their focus group of "uncommitted" voters. There are actually a half dozen black voters in Columbus, Ohio who are still considering voting for John McCain?

8:58 PM - KT - Guys, get jealous. I'm blogging from the world's best focus group for this particular event: FORTUNE's Most Powerful Women summit. There are hundreds of very impressive women here. From where I am sitting, I can see Martha Stewart, Sally Ride, Billie Jean King, Meg Whitman ... Well, I'll s
top here. And, yes, there's wine.

At my little table, we have Christie Hefner and Clinton HHS Secretary Donna Shalala. I've got my fact check covered on those health care questions.